FPGA Mining: Field Programmable Gate Arrays Crypto Guide ...
FPGA Mining: Field Programmable Gate Arrays Crypto Guide ...
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Why FPGA will rule Cryptomining in 2018 FreeLearner.how
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Cryptocurrency Mining Hardware in 2019 - Updated
Building an ASIC miner with FPGA chips or manufactured IC's available on the market
Hi again. I recently made a post on using Arduino to replace bitcoin miners and i realized how crazily stupid that decision would be seeming as a typical Arduino has a hash rate of around 50 Now I needed a new way to build an ASIC miner seeing as Arduinos are out of the question. The two possible methods I came up with/discovered was by using multiple FPGA chips to do the exact calculations needed. The other is by using pre-manufactured IC's from older GPU's, buying them in bulk and building many GPU's that are built around those IC's I have three questions:
What do you guys think about using FPGA's or manufactured IC's to make the bitcoin miner?
Are there any articles you know of where people have attempted a similar project
Trading now open on low cap, low risk 900k circulating coin: AGA
Welcome to AGA TOKEN! AGA PLATFORM Aga Platform is a profitable ASIC and FPGA cryptocurrency mining operation with mining facilities located in Eastern Washington, where electricity prices are one of the lowest in the world. Primarily we mine Bitcoin, Bitcoin Cash, Litecoin, Dash, Digibyte, Verge and Decred. AGA Token will be using Cryptocurrency mining to fund its staking rewards and to back its price. This simple, yet, revolutionary approach aims to deliver substantial returns to all AGA Token holders through liquidity pool staking and price appreciation. $AGA Token Uniswap Listing Update https://medium.com/@AGAToken/aga-token-uniswap-listing-update-8510e490b75b Owner of AGA: @twojewoda Please join the following channels for updates 💰 AGA Trade Floor 💰 @agatradefloor 📢 AGA Announcements 📢 @agatoken Website: http://www.agatoken.com Twitter: https://twitter.com/agatkn Uniswap: https://uniswap.info/token/0x2d80f5f5328fdcb6eceb7cacf5dd8aedaec94e20 Etherscan: https://etherscan.io/address/0x2d80f5f5328fdcb6eceb7cacf5dd8aedaec94e20 This is a well established, working and mining organization, with a well known and regarded CEO, who is active in the TG group. He is well regarded among other crypto communities. Ferrums founder, Ian Friend, was seen mingling in the AGA chat today and is yet to be determined whether he is involved with the project. When questioned, his response was, "wait and see". Why worry about being rugged on risky coins, when you can churn out some easy Eths with this comfy, low risk buy?? Marketcap is around $2.5million on this atm and price at time of this post is $2.79 per coin. Last but not least, only 900k in circulation! With some marketing and exposure, expect this to 4x over the next few weeks, but if we are entering the bull run, as many suspect, all bets are off and these low caps could moon. This is as low risk as they come IMO, but still, DYOR. https://imgur.com/Uyt4Ma3
AGA https://etherscan.io/address/0x2d80f5f5328fdcb6eceb7cacf5dd8aedaec94e20 Uniswap Meet AGA, the mining backed, high APY, DEFI, governance token managed by an experienced team of professionals with diverse experience in technology and construction at companies like Accenture, Microsoft, NetApp and University Mechanical Contractors! Today there are countless tokens offering various levels of staking rewards. Decred voting, XTZ staking, ZEN nodes, and many more. New generation of DeFi tokens have cropped up and offer yield farming rewards in return for pooled liquidity on Uniswap, Balancer and others. Some even offer 10,000% APY returns (in their native unlimited supply token). Unfortunately, with only few exceptions most of these tokens don’t have any source of revenue to fund these rewards and to justify their price. Furthermore, these rewards dilute the supply and ultimately drive the price down. AGA Token changes this by using Cryptocurrency mining to fund its staking rewards and to back its price. This simple, yet, revolutionary approach aims to deliver substantial returns to all AGA Token holders through liquidity pool staking and price appreciation. Aga Platform is a profitable ASIC and FPGA cryptocurrency mining operation with mining facilities located in Eastern Washington, where electricity prices are one of the lowest in the world. Primarily we mine Bitcoin, Bitcoin Cash, Litecoin, Dash, Digibyte, Verge and Decred. You can monitor mining profitability via our NiceHash dashboard by clicking the screen on the right. AGA Token and Aga Platform are managed by an experienced team of professionals with diverse experience in technology and construction at companies like Accenture, Microsoft, NetApp and University Mechanical Contractors. 📌 MC at time of writing ~ 800K 📌 Total supply: 10.9M 📌 Circulating supply 843K ‼️SOME IMPORTANT LINKS ‼️ 📍CMC - https://coinmarketcap.com/currencies/aga/ 📍Website -https://agatoken.com/ 📍Etherscan - https://etherscan.io/token/0x2d80f5f5328fdcb6eceb7cacf5dd8aedaec94e20 📍Telegram - https://t.me/agatokengroup 📍Twitter - https://twitter.com/agatkn 📍Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/Aga-Token-107736531016089 📍AGA Rewards: https://agatoken.com/promotions/#agatoken 💹💹 Where to Buy: https://app.uniswap.org/#/swap?inputCurrency=0x2d80f5f5328fdcb6eceb7cacf5dd8aedaec94e20 Found By: @BlueDemise Written By: @alexanderthethrid
A field-programmable gate array (FPGA) is a chip that can be programmed to suit whatever purpose you want, as often as you want it and wherever you need it. FPGAs provide multiple advantages, including low latency, high throughput and energy efficiency. To fully understand what FPGAs offer, imagine a performance spectrum. At one end, you have the central processing unit (CPU), which offers a generic set of instructions that can be combined to carry out an array of different tasks. This makes a CPU extremely flexible, and its behaviour can be defined through software. However, CPUs are also slow because they have to select from the available generic instructions to complete each task. In a sense, they’re a “jack of all trades, but a master of none”. At the other end of the spectrum sit application-specific integrated circuits (ASICs). These are potentially much faster because they have been built with a single task in mind, making them a “master of one trade”. This is the kind of chip people use to mine bitcoin, for example. The downside of ASICs is that they can’t be changed, and they cost time and money to develop. FPGAs offer a perfect middle ground: they can be significantly faster than a CPU and are more flexible than ASICs. FPGAs contain thousands, sometimes even millions, of so-called core logic blocks (CLBs). These blocks can be configured and combined to process any task that can be solved by a CPU. Compared with a CPU, FPGAs aren’t burdened by surplus hardware that would otherwise slow you down. They can therefore be used to carry out specific tasks quickly and effectively, and can even process several tasks simultaneously. These characteristics make them popular across a wide range of sectors, from aerospace to medical engineering and security systems, and of course finance. How are FPGAs used in the financial services sector? Speed and versatility are particularly important when buying or selling stocks and other securities. In the era of electronic trading, decisions are made in the blink of an eye. As prices change and orders come and go, companies are fed new information from exchanges and other sources via high-speed networks. This information arrives at high speeds, with time measured in nanoseconds. The sheer volume and speed of data demands a high bandwidth to process it all. Specialized trading algorithms make use of the new information in order to make trades. FPGAs provide the perfect platform to develop these applications, as they allow you to bypass non-essential software as well as generic-purpose hardware. How do market makers use FPGAs to provide liquidity? As a market maker, IMC provides liquidity to buyers and sellers of financial instruments. This requires us to price every instrument we trade and to react to the market accordingly. Valuation is a view on what the price of an asset should be, which is handled by our traders and our automated pricing algorithms. When a counterpart wants to buy or sell an asset on a trading venue, our role is to always be there and offer, or bid, a fair price for the asset. FPGAs enable us to perform this key function in the most efficient way possible. At IMC, we keep a close eye on emerging technologies that can potentially improve our business. We began working with FPGAs more than a decade ago and are constantly exploring ways to develop this evolving technology. We work in a competitive industry, so our engineers have to be on their toes to make sure we’re continuously improving. What does an FPGA engineer do? Being an FPGA engineer is all about learning and identifying new solutions to challenges as they arise. A software developer can write code in a software language and know within seconds whether it works, and so deploy it quickly. However, the code will have to go through several abstraction layers and generic hardware components. Although you can deploy the code quickly, you do not get the fastest possible outcome. As an FPGA engineer, it may take two to three hours of compilation time before you know whether your adjustment will result in the outcome you want. However, you can increase performance at the cost of more engineering time. The day-to-day challenge you face is how to make the process as efficient as possible with the given trade-offs while pushing the boundaries of the FPGA technology. Skills needed to be an FPGA engineer Things change extremely rapidly in the trading world, and agility is the name of the game. Unsurprisingly, FPGA engineers tend to enjoy a challenge. To work as an FGPA engineer at a company like IMC, you have to be a great problem-solver, a quick learner and highly adaptable. What makes IMC a great fit for an FPGA engineer? IMC offers a great team dynamic. We are a smaller company than many larger technology or finance houses, and we operate very much like a family unit. This means that, as a graduate engineer, you’ll never be far from the action, and you’ll be able to make an impact from day one. Another key difference is that you’ll get to see the final outcome of your work. If you come up with an idea, we’ll give you the chance to make it work. If it does, you’ll see the results put into practice in a matter of days, which is always a great feeling. If it doesn’t, you’ll get to find out why – so there’s an opportunity to learn and improve for next time. Ultimately, working at IMC is about having skin in the game. You’ll be entrusted with making your own decisions. And you’ll be working side by side with super smart people who are open-minded and always interested in hearing your ideas. Market making is a technology-dependent process, and we’re all in this together. Think you have what it takes to make a difference at a technology graduate at IMC?Check out our graduate opportunities page.
[–]OverkillerSRB 3 ポイント 2時間前 It's a dead fork of Bitcoin, result of community unhappiness with where Bitcoin was going. Either way, it's "maintained" by Bitmain (from their wallet at least) which is a non-alternative. If you want electronic, peer to peer, private cash, Monero is the way to go.
There are at least three big lies in this post if we skip the bitmain statement:
That Bitcoin Cash is a "dead fork" of Bitcion.
That Bitcoin Cash is not usable as p2p, private (CashShuffle) digitial Cash.
That Monero somehow is.
Monero of course is completely unusable in comparison to Bitcoin Cash. You have to wait at the very least 20 minutes after spending your funds before you're able to spend them again. I.e. if you send a submaximal amount of monero, you can't use the rest of your funds for twenty minutes! Monero is also not any faster transactionally than BCH. Having a faster block time doesn't mean you're faster, it just means you're accepting less security per confirmation. Not to mention that the Monero core wallet is nearly impossible to sync. Often you are told to use a "remote node", but this dramatically weakens your privacy. More so than the default weakness that comes with Monero's really small anon set, and the tracing attacks linked below.
We show how an attacker can take advantage of Monero’s Bulletproof protocol, which reduces transaction fees, to flood the network with his own transactions and, consequently, remove mixins from transaction inputs. Assuming an attack timeframe of 12 months, our findings show that an attacker can trace up to 47.63% of the transaction inputs at a cost of just 1,746.53 USD.1 Moreover, we show also that more than 90% of the inputs are affected by our tracing algorithm.
That cost was based on transactions with 100 outputs, while the monero protocol limits this number to 16, which increases the cost of the attack to roughly $10,000 USD
Please stay on topic: this post is only for comments discussing the uncertainties, shortcomings, and concerns some may have about Monero. NOT the positive aspects of it. Discussion can relate to the technology itself or economics. Talk about community and price is not wanted, but some discussion about it maybe allowed if it relates well. Be as respectful and nice as possible. This discussion has potential to be more emotionally charged as it may bring up issues that are extremely upsetting: many people are not only financially but emotionally invested in the ideas and tools around Monero. It's better to keep it calm then to stir the pot, so don't talk down to people, insult them for spelling/grammar, personal insults, etc. This should only be calm rational discussion about the technical and economic aspects of Monero. "Do unto others 20% better than you'd expect them to do unto you to correct subjective error." - Linus Pauling How it works: Post your concerns about Monero in reply to this main post. If you can address these concerns, or add further details to them - reply to that comment. This will make it easily sortable Upvote the comments that are the most valid criticisms of it that have few or no real honest solutions/answers to them. The comment that mentions the biggest problems of Monero should have the most karma. As a community, as developers, we need to know about them. Even if they make us feel bad, we got to upvote them. https://youtu.be/vKA4w2O61Xo To learn more about the idea behind Monero Skepticism Sunday, check out the first post about it: https://np.reddit.com/Monero/comments/75w7wt/can_we_make_skepticism_sunday_a_part_of_the/
Mining for Profitability - Horizen (formerly ZenCash) Thanks Early GPU Miners
Thank you for inviting Horizen to the GPU mining AMA! ZEN had a great run of GPU mining that lasted well over a year, and brought lots of value to the early Zclassic miners. It is mined using Equihash protocol, and there have been ASIC miners available for the algorithm since about June of 2018. GPU mining is not really profitable for Horizen at this point in time. We’ve got a lot of miners in the Horizen community, and many GPU miners also buy ASIC miners. Happy to talk about algorithm changes, security, and any other aspect of mining in the questions below. There are also links to the Horizen website, blog post, etc. below. So, if I’m not here to ask you to mine, hold, and love ZEN, what can I offer? Notes on some of the lessons I’ve learned about maximizing mining profitability. An update on Horizen - there is life after moving on from GPU mining. As well as answering your questions during the next 7 days. _____________________________________________________________________________________________________
Mining for Profitability - Horizen (formerly ZenCash) Thanks Early GPU Miners
Author: Rolf Versluis - co-founder of Horizen
In GPU mining, just like in many of the activities involved with Bitcoin and cryptocurrencies, there is both a cycle and a progression. The Bitcoin price cycle is fairly steady, and by creating a personal handbook of actions to take during the cycle, GPU miners can maximize their profitability. Maximizing profitability isn't the only aspect of GPU mining that is important, of course, but it is helpful to be able to invest in new hardware, and be able to have enough time to spend on building and maintaining the GPU miners. If it was a constant process that also involved losing money, then it wouldn't be as much fun.
For a given mining algorithm, there is definitely a technology progression. We can look back on the technology that was used to mine Bitcoin and see how it first started off as Central Processing Unit (CPU) mining, then it moved to Graphical Processing Unit (GPU) mining, then Field Programmable Gate Array (FPGA), and then Application Specific Integrated Circuit (ASIC). Throughout this evolution we have witnessed a variety of unsavory business practices that unfortunately still happen on occasion, like ASIC Miner manufacturers taking pre-orders 6 months in advance, GPU manufacturers creating commercial cards for large farms that are difficult for retail customers to secure and ASIC Miner manufacturers mining on gear for months before making it available for sale. When a new crypto-currency is created, in many cases a new mining algorithm is created also. This is important, because if an existing algorithm was used, the coin would be open to a 51% attack from day one, and may not even be able to build a valid blockchain. Because there's such a focus on profitable software, developers for GPU mining applications are usually able to write a mining application fairly rapidly, then iterate it to the limit of current GPU technology. If it looks like a promising new cryptocurrency, FPGA stream developers and ASIC Hardware Developers start working on their designs at the same time. The people who create the hashing algorithms run by the miners are usually not very familiar with the design capabilities of Hardware manufacturers. Building application-specific semiconductors is an industry that's almost 60 years old now, and FPGA’s have been around for almost 35 years. This is an industry that has very experienced engineers using advanced design and modeling tools. Promising cryptocurrencies are usually ones that are deploying new technology, or going after a big market, and who have at least a team of talented software developers. In the best case, the project has a full-stack business team involving development, project management, systems administration, marketing, sales, and leadership. This is the type of project that attracts early investment from the market, which will drive the price of the coin up significantly in the first year. For any cryptocurrency that's a worthwhile investment of time, money, and electricity for the hashing, there will be a ASIC miners developed for it. Instead of fighting this technology progression, GPU miners may be better off recognizing it as inevitable, and taking advantage of the cryptocurrency cycle to maximize GPU mining profitability instead.
Cryptocurrency Price Cycle
For quality crypto projects, in addition to the one-way technology progression of CPU -> GPU -> FPGA -> ASIC, there is an upward price progression. More importantly, there is a cryptocurrency price cycle that oscillates around an overall upgrade price progression. Plotted against time, a cycle with an upward progressions looks like a sine wave with an ever increasing average value, which is what we see so far with the Bitcoin price. Cryptocurrency price cycle and progression for miners This means mining promising new cryptocurrencies with GPU miners, holding them as the price rises, and being ready to sell a significant portion in the first year. Just about every cryptocurrency is going to have a sharp price rise at some point, whether through institutional investor interest or by being the target of a pump-and-dump operation. It’s especially likely in the first year, while the supply is low and there is not much trading volume or liquidity on exchanges. Miners need to operate in the world of government money, as well as cryptocurrency. The people who run mining businesses at some point have to start selling their mining proceeds to pay the bills, and to buy new equipment as the existing equipment becomes obsolete. Working to maximize profitability means more than just mining new cryptocurrencies, it also means learning when to sell and how to manage money.
Managing Cash for Miners
The worst thing that can happen to a business is to run out of cash. When that happens, the business usually shuts down and goes into bankruptcy. Sometimes an investor comes in and picks up the pieces, but at the point the former owners become employees. There are two sides to managing cash - one is earning it, the other is spending it, and the cryptocurrency price cycle can tell the GPU miner when it is the best time to do certain things. A market top and bottom is easy to recognize in hindsight, and harder to see when in the middle of it. Even if a miner is able to recognize the tops and bottoms, it is difficult to act when there is so much hype and positivity at the top of the cycle, and so much gloom and doom at the bottom. A decent rule of thumb for the last few cycles appears to be that at the top and bottom of the cycle BTC is 10x as expensive compared to USD as the last cycle. Newer crypto projects tend to have bigger price swings than Bitcoin, and during the rising of the pricing cycle there is the possibility that an altcoin will have a rise to 100x its starting price. Taking profits from selling altcoins during the rise is important, but so is maintaining a reserve. In order to catch a 100x move, it may be worth the risk to put some of the altcoin on an exchange and set a very high limit order. For the larger cryptocurrencies like Bitcoin it is important to set trailing sell stops on the way up, and to not buy back in for at least a month if a sell stop gets triggered. Being able to read price charts, see support and resistance areas for price, and knowing how to set sell orders are an important part of mining profitability.
Actions to Take During the Cycle
As the cycle starts to rise from the bottom, this is a good time to buy mining hardware - it will be inexpensive. Also to mine and buy altcoins, which are usually the first to see a price rise, and will have larger price increases than Bitcoin. On the rise of the cycle, this is a good time to see which altcoins are doing well from a project fundamentals standpoint, and which ones look like they are undergoing accumulation from investors. Halfway through the rise of the cycle is the time to start selling altcoins for the larger project cryptos like Bitcoin. Miners will miss some of the profit at the top of the cycle, but will not run out of cash by doing this. This is also the time to stop buying mining hardware. Don’t worry, you’ll be able to pick up that same hardware used for a fraction of the price at the next bottom. As the price nears the top of the cycle, sell enough Bitcoin and other cryptocurrencies to meet the following projected costs:
Mining electricity costs for the next 12 months
Planned investment into new miners for the next cycle
Additional funds needed for things like supporting a family or buying a Lambo
Taxes on all the capital gains from the sale of cryptocurrencies
It may be worth selling 70-90% of crypto holdings, maintaining a reserve in case there is second upward move caused by government bankruptcies. But selling a large part of the crypto is helpful to maintaining profitability and having enough cash reserves to make it through the bottom part of the next cycle. As the cycle has peaked and starts to decline, this is a good time to start investing in mining facilities and other infrastructure, brush up on trading skills, count your winnings, and take some vacation. At the bottom of the cycle, it is time to start buying both used and new mining equipment. The bottom can be hard to recognize. If you can continue to mine all the way through bottom part of the cryptocurrency pricing cycle, paying with the funds sold near the top, you will have a profitable and enjoyable cryptocurrency mining business. Any cryptocurrency you are able to hold onto will benefit from the price progression in the next higher cycle phase.
An Update on Horizen - formerly ZenCash
The team at Horizen recognizes the important part that GPU miners played in the early success of Zclassic and ZenCash, and there is always a welcoming attitude to any of ZEN miners, past and present. About 1 year after ZenCash launched, ASIC miners became available for the Equihash algorithm. Looking at a chart of mining difficulty over time shows when it was time for GPU miners to move to mining other cryptocurrencies. Horizen Historical Block Difficulty Graph Looking at the hashrate chart, it is straightforward to see that ASIC miners were deployed starting June 2018. It appears that there was a jump in mining hashrate in October of 2017. This may have been larger GPU farms switching over to mine Horizen, FPGA’s on the network, or early version of Equihash ASIC miners that were kept private. The team understands the importance of the cryptocurrency price cycle as it affects the funds from the Horizen treasury and the investments that can be made. 20% of each block mined is sent to the Horizen non-profit foundation for use to improve the project. Just like miners have to manage money, the team has to decide whether to spend funds when the price is high or convert it to another form in preparation for the bottom part of the cycle. During the rise and upper part of the last price cycle Horizen was working hard to maximize the value of the project through many different ways, including spending on research and development, project management, marketing, business development with exchanges and merchants, and working to create adoption in all the countries of the world. During the lower half of the cycle Horizen has reduced the team to the essentials, and worked to build a base of users, relationships with investors, exchanges, and merchants, and continue to develop the higher priority software projects. Lower priority software development, going to trade shows, and paying for business partnerships like exchanges and applications have all been completely stopped. Miners are still a very important part of the Horizen ecosystem, earning 60% of the block reward. 20% goes to node operators, with 20% to the foundation. In the summer of 2018 the consensus algorithm was modified slightly to make it much more difficult for any group of miners to perform a 51% attack on Horizen. This has so far proven effective. The team is strong, we provide monthly updates on a YouTube live stream on the first Wednesday of each month where all questions asked during the stream are addressed, and our marketing team works to develop awareness of Horizen worldwide. New wallet software was released recently, and it is the foundation application for people to use and manage their ZEN going forward. Horizen is a Proof of Work cryptocurrency, and there is no plan to change that by the current development team. If there is a security or centralization concern, there may be change to the algorithm, but that appears unlikely at this time, as the hidden chain mining penalty looks like it is effective in stopping 51% attacks. During 2019 and 2020 the Horizen team plans to release many new software updates:
Sidechains modification to main software
Sidechain Software Development Kit
Governance and Treasury application running on a sidechain
Node tracking and payments running on a sidechain
Conversion from blockchain to a Proof of Work BlockDAG using Equihash mining algorithm
Rolf Versluis is Co-Founder and Executive Advisor of the privacy oriented cryptocurrency Horizen. He also operates multiple private cryptocurrency mining facilities with hundreds of operational systems, and has a blog and YouTube channel on crypto mining called Block Operations. Rolf applies his engineering background as well as management and leadership experience from running a 60 person IT company in Atlanta and as a US Navy nuclear submarine officer operating out of Hawaii to help grow and improve the businesses in which he is involved. _____________________________________________________________________________________________ Thank you again for the Ask Me Anything - please do. I'll be checking the post and answering questions actively from 28 Feb to 6 Mar 2019 - Rolf
BitcoinSOV (BSOV) Trading is Coming to Resfinex on 08 Feb 2020.
Dear Users, We are pleased to announce that BitcoinSOV (BSOV) will be listed on 08th Feb 2020. What is BitcoinSOV (BSOV)? BitcoinSOV is a 100% community-driven cryptocurrency, and does not rely on centralized decision makers or traditional power structures to survive. This deflationary grassroots movement is built from the bottom-up, and is fully reliant on people like you to build it. We use non-violent methods of action — we fight for financial independence, and freedom from inflation.
1% of every BSOV transaction is destroyed forever.
Voluntary Proof-of-Commitment by the community.
BSOV is a mineable ERC20 token by using your graphics card or FPGA.
15 % of max supply has already been mined since June 2019.
Limit orders are recommended when trading starts since the markets may be illiquid initially. Be extremely careful with market orders.
Thanks for your support, Resfinex Team Invest with caution Listing an asset or token for trade is not a recommendation to buy, sell, or participate in the associated network. Do your own research and invest at your own risk.
E: Going to bed, will contribute more tomorrow. Thanks for the discussion! Myth: Mining is more stressful than gaming. Fact: It depends. During the old days, this was plausible, because older GPUs (Pre-polaris) are/were bottlenecked by core clock when mining the most profitable coins. Thus, miners overclocked and overvolted these cards quite frequently, especially with cheap electricity. This meant that those cards were often run hot, pushing the limits and stressing VRM and fans quite a lot. Nowadays, ethash (Ethereum) is the most profitable algorithm for AMD cards 99% of the time, and newer GPUs (Polaris) are limited by memory bandwidth and latency. Miners can underclock core to the low 1100MHz range before seeing performance drop. To save power, miners who know what they are doing also undervolt, since it is no longer necessary to sustain a high core clock. Thus, it is quite feasible to run polaris cards below 70C at a reasonable fan speed. However, dual mining (mining more than one coin at once) does increase power consumption by up to 20%, and there are also idiots who run their polaris cards OCd while mining. With the exception of a few idiots, miners treat their Polaris GPUs pretty much the same; that is, running underclocked and undervolted 24/7 with a memory strap mod and mem OC. On the other hand, former gaming cards are highly variable in use cases. Some gamers leave their cards at stock settings, some undervolt, and some OC and/or overvolt. Most of the time, these cards are thermal cycled far more often than mining cards, which is known to weaken solder. Another thing to consider is that manufacturers have learned (somewhat) from their mistakes of putting shit tier fans in GPUs, and many fans on modern GPUs are ball bearing and/or swappable. Even some budget cards, such as MSI Armor, use decent ball bearing fans. Bottom line: the risk of buying mined Polaris cards is not as high as the risk of buying older mined cards. I would not be against buying mined polaris cards, but it's not necessarily better than buying a gamer's card instead. At the end of the day, it depends more on how the owner treated it than what they used it for. Myth: GPUs are obsolete because of FPGAs and ASICs Fact: Mostly false. Older algorithms such as scrypt and SHA256 (lite/doge/feathebitcoin etc) are no longer feasible to mine with GPUs, but there have been multiple algorithms since then that are built to deter ASICs; most of the time it is done by making it memory-hard because designing an ASIC with high memory throughput is considerably more expensive to design and manufacture. Many devs prefer their blockchain to be ASIC resistant to avoid the concentration of power problem that Bitcoin is having nowadays, where a giant, near-monopolistic ASIC manufacturer (Bitmain) is causing a lot of (subjective) controversy. Blockchains based on ethash (Ethereum and its forks), equihash (Zcash and its forks) and cryptonight (Monero and forks) are some examples, but there are scores of other shitcoins and a few other algos that are GPU dominant. It is almost impossible that there will be another ASIC takeover, which is what was responsible for the stop in GPU demand in the bitcoin and litecoin days. Bottom line: ASICs no longer threaten GPU miners, or the demand for GPUs Myth: Ethereum switching to Proof of Stake will kill mining soon Fact: Doomsayers have been preaching about proof of stake since late 2015. It has always been "coming soon." The fact is, the Ethereum roadmap goes from proof of work (mining) -> Casper (mining + PoS) -> Metropolis (PoS). Currently, the release date of Casper is not even announced yet, nor is it being tested in a (public) testnet. Proof of Stake might one day take over, but mining is here to stay for a while yet. Another thing to consider is that there are tons of other GPU mineable blockchains, and although Ethereum is biggest, it is certainly feasible that mining stays profitable even after Ethereum goes PoS (if it ever does). However, it is possible that profits will be low enough to discourage new miners. Bottom line: It's very unlikely. E: I screwed up the roadmap; here is a better source than me with some interesting information: https://www.ethnews.com/ethereums-vitalik-buterin-gives-keynote-on-metropolis Myth: The current Ethereum demand spike is a bubble Opinion: Honestly, I don't know. I would not be surprised if stricter regulations on ICOs come sooner or later, which would fuck with Ether prices. There is also the inherent volatility of cryptocurrencies. However, it is also possible that blockchain technology continues to gain traction; that is, the price could just as easily go up as go down. Although it's fun to read about other people's opinions, only time-travelling wizards can tell you when it will become economical again to upgrade your poor HD5770. Bottom line: No one knows. Myth: Miners will "steal" all the RX Vegas Fact: Only a reckless miner would buy Vegas on release, since mining performance is not known. In fact, it is possible that it can't mine at all (or at some stupidly low speed) until devs add support to existing miners. It would be even more reckless than gamers who buy without seeing benchmarks, since at least gamers can expect the games to actually run. It's also not necessarily the case that Vega will be good once miners do add support. Maybe there will be enough reckless miners to affect supply, maybe not. Of course, it is possible that miners will deplete the supply after it is demonstrated that Vega is good for mining. Bottom line: Most miners won't preorder, but it's possible that a significant number will. E: Important to remember that even if mining demand isn't high, doesn't mean that supply will be plentiful. Myth: Nvidia cards SUCK at mining Fact: Mostly false. They USED to suck in the old pre-Maxwell days, but now they are actually more efficient at mining Ethereum and Zcash compared to AMD cards, even after both cards are undervolted. The flipside is that they (used to) cost more for the equivalent hashrate. For reference, my old 5xRX470 rig drew just under 800W when mining ETH only and hashed at 150MH/s. My current 6xGTX1060 rig draws just over half of that (<450W) and hashes at about 135MH/s. Certainly not as good in raw performance, but they are viable nonetheless, especially given the AMD GPU shortage. In fact, Nvidia cards (1060 and especially 1070) are becoming scarce as well. Bottom line: Nvidia is still the underdog when it comes to mining, but far from irrelevant nowadays. Myth: 4GB cards will be obsolete for mining soon Fact: FALSE. The Ethereum DAG is not even 3GB yet, and won't be for a few months. The recent reports of 4GB Polaris cards slowing down soon due to DAG size is caused by limited TLB capacity, not VRAM restrictions. Polaris cards will still be able to mine ETH forks such as Expanse and UBIQ without diminished speed, and even if they are used to mine ETH, it is not that much of a performance hit at first. It would certainly not make polaris useless or undesirable for mining anytime soon. Tahiti GPUs already suffer from this issue and Hawaii is the most resistant to this issue. Have not benched Nvidia at a later epoch. Myth: Creating miner-bashing posts on Reddit will help alleviate the GPU supply problem Fact: False, you are simply giving cryptocurrencies and mining more exposure to the general public, increasing demand. Myth: Mining-specific GPUs will solve the shortage problems Opinion: There's not enough info to tell yet, but I am a skeptic for the following reasons. First, no display limits the resale value of the card for obvious reasons. IMO, the whole point of crypto mining from a profitability standpoint is to have a hedge against coin volatility (hardware is still worth something if the coin crashes). Otherwise it is much less effort to just buy and hold the coin. If the hardware is useless without demand from other (significant) sources, then it doesn't make much sense to buy it unless the price is extremely low. I'm sure that cost-downing the PCB and warranty will make for a cheap card, but it has to be extremely cheap and plentiful in supply, or else miners will buy whatever they can get. I could envision "failed" chips (not meeting spec of consumer editions) being stuck in miner cards, but I doubt there are enough to meet demand without ramping up production as a whole, which carries its own risks. I guess that it would help a little, but probably not solve the problems. Alternatively, since modern GPUs are bottlenecked by RAM when mining, it might be enticing to miners to have the fastest (GDDR5) RAM on the market (probably the 9gbps chips from the 1060 6G 9gbps edition, although I don't have one to test). However, my previous points still apply; buying such a card without display outputs carries a big risk. Bottom line: It's not a great idea, unless they are super cheap or use really good RAM. Hope this helped; if you have any further questions I will try to answer them. I'm both a gamer and miner who uses both AMD and Nvidia roughly equally and don't favor one group over another. I've mined and gamed on all high end AMD GPUs since Tahiti (except Tonga) and all Pascal cards except 1050ti.
Looks like the table has turned. Newegg, Fry's, and Micron email me nearly every day with gpu deals. 1070 ti for $450 after coupon code. 570/580s for $250. Remember when these retailers raised prices to gouge and saved inventory for their precious gamer customers? There are only so many pc gamers worldwide and I doubt they can absorb all the excess inventory, so the prices will continue to slide. I'm waiting for the eventual gpu fire sale in 3Q/4Q this year to buy more, if cryptocurrency market doesn't fall further.
Anyone ever bought a second-hand FPGA miner to use as an FPGA?
Many bitcoin enthusiasts invested in FPGA miners, but such hardware became unprofitable after ASIC miners took off. So did the FGPA miners get sold off for cheap like GPU miners? If so did anyone here buy one second hand, and what was your experience with it like?
Ritocoin - a 100% community driven project based on Ravencoin
tl:dr: Ritocoin is a code fork of the Ravencoin codebase and continues to track future Ravencoin developments. The project was launched to provide a more community-oriented blockchain with the same functionality as Ravencoin, without a corporate overseer, and with a more flexible model for community participation and development. It’s intention is to be a hacker’s playground for innovative ideas. Specifications Proof-of-Work Algorithm: X21S Block Time: 60 seconds POW Block Reward: Smooth curve down Community fund: 1% first year Difficulty Retargeting: DGW-180 Maximum Supply: 6 months: 993,521,892 RITO 1 year: 1,227,448,858 RITO 5 years: 1,762,210,058 RITO 10 years: 1,820,404,381 RITO 50 years: 2,030,907,256 RITO 100 years: 2,293,707,246 RITO Infinite: 10 RITO per block in perpetuity Pre-mine: None Masternodes: Researching for use case Asset layer: Was enabled at height 50,000 Links Website /ritocoin Explorer Github Whitepaper twitter [ANN] X21S This hashing algorithm was created specifically for Ritocoin, and was designed to resist FPGAs, ASICs, and NiceHash. It is X16S (16 algorithms shuffled and hashed),, followed by 5 additional hashing algorithms: haval256, tiger, lyra2, gost512, and sha256. The inclusion of lyra2 brings numerous advantages, making parallelization of the algorithm practically impossible, with each step relying on the previous step having already been computed. It is a “friendly” algorithm that makes GPUs produce much less heat and uses less electricity during mining. Take your time to learn more about us in the below story of Ritocoin... The spirit of Bitcoin continues to inspire, empower and enable people around the globe. Ten years later, just as it seemed Bitcoin was being defined by commercial agents and regulated governance, that same free and independent spirit imbued the Ravencoin community. In ten short months, however, 30% of the Ravencoin project’s net hash comes from NiceHash and the looming impact of the imminent FPGA mining cards and X16R bitstreams certainly promises to shake up the dream of this GPU miner’s darling. Ravencoin’s fair launch genuinely inspired our developers and supporters. We admire the way Ravencoin came out swinging — fighting for fairness, an honest distribution of coins and a place where GPU miners could thrive. The asset layer attracted many more miners and investors to the pools. Many Ritocoin enthusiasts came from the Ravencoin community, and continue their association with that project. The whole crypto ecosystem should appreciate the work begun by Ravencoin. Obviously they continue to inspire and motivate us to this day. It’s the reason we took action. We decided to start our own project which focuses upon at least two pillars of decentralized networks in the crypto space: community governance and a fair distribution of coins. It is a core belief throughout Ritocoin that in order to successfully develop and maintain this hacker’s playground — a place where a broad range of ideas could be tried and allowed to flourish — these two ideals must be allowed to drive and guide our community. This deep focus on community choices creates a project flexible enough to support most ideas, and agile enough to define new frontiers. A mining network’s distributed ledger is defined by its technology. Like many in the broader crypto-mining community, we value the GPU for its accessibility. These processors are available for purchase all around the world without any legal restrictions. GPUs are vastly more accessible for hobbyists and miners to acquire. They can be shipped nearly anywhere around the globe, a nice benefit to the popular secondary market which has sprung up much to the chagrin of PC gamers. More constraints exist for the ASIC and FPGA miner. Laws in some parts of the world restrict people from using or buying ASIC and FPGA mining hardware. This alone is directly in confrontation with Ritocoin’s core values of decentralized stewardship and sovereignty. The GPU, in essence, is like your voice. Anyone with the means of acquiring one GPU should be able to have their voice heard. ASIC and FPGA mining devalues the GPU miner’s voice and silos that coin’s network away from the small scale and personal mining operator. A truly community driven project means each stakeholder, regardless of size of contribution to the network’s net hash, has an opportunity to build, vote and direct. If you are already familiar with our website, discord or whitepaper, you are probably aware that masternodes had been proposed as a feature of the network from the beginning. This opened the door to ongoing discussions in the Ritocoin community regarding ● A masternode’s true purpose ● What benefit they provide to the project ● How the benefit is realized ● The collateral This discussion, governed entirely by stakeholders across the extended network yielded a defining moment for our vision of flexibility. We have not yet found the potential utility of masternodes, however, the conversation has not reached an extent to where we could abandon the idea. To quote one of our developers during this discussion on our Discord:
“Just want to give a reminder here that even though masternodes are on the roadmap, it is not set in stone. This coin belongs to the community and we will do what we as a community want to do. If we conclude that we want to take this coin a different direction than masternodes, then that is what we’ll do.” --traysi
We are all volunteers at Ritocoin. Our moderators and community leaders try to give immediate support to all users that require it. Contact us in Discord or Telegram, not only for support, but, proposing new ideas, revising old ones and just so you can find a place to get together and find people to hang out with. You are well within your rights to enjoy yourself at any given moment, and, should you feel so inclined to begin working with the team, we just so happen to be looking for ambitious individuals that see themselves as being part of a greater vision, are inspired by change, and inspired to be the change they want to see making things better in this world. Join us in a space where your ideas to build something great can become a reality. We are eager to know what you think is best for the future of Rito. What steps would you take to become more resilient, stronger, fair and decentralized? Because at the end of the day, like it or not, love it or leave it.. this is your coin, too. You can become a significant part of this project. We will help you further develop the role you wish to fill in the cryptocurrency space — influencer, developer, analyst, you name it. This is not a just-for-developer’s playground. We want the enthusiasts. We want the perplexed and the rabbit-hole divers. This is the coin for everyone who is trying to find their place on the path that Satoshi began unfolding in 2008 after the collapse of the housing market rippled out into the subsequent crash of global markets. That’s why we have Bitcoin, remember? Be your own bank. This is why Satoshi and Bitcoin.org kept their software open source. It’s up to us to keep the torch ablaze. Community funds For the first year, about 1% of mined coins are set aside into a developers fund that is used to provide bounties to the community developers who make substantial development contributions to the Ritocoin ecosystem. We have already paid out numerous bounties for important work that has already benefits Ritocoin in substantial ways. We also have another donation-driven community fund that has recently been put together for the purposes of doing fun contests and things like that. Cooperation and collaborations We have discovered a number of fatal flaws in the original Ravencoin codebase and worked with the Ravencoin developers to get those fixed in both Ritocoin and Ravencoin. This work has benefitted Ravencoin in numerous ways and we look forward to a long time of collaboration and cooperation between us and them. Many members of the Safecoin team are also in our discord group, and have collaborated with us in shaping the future decisions of Ritocoin. We have several thousand members in our group and they represent all walks of cryptocurrency life. We invite all coin developers, miners and enthusiasts to join our discord and be a part of this coin that truly belongs entirely to the community. Block reward A couple weeks ago we met for a scheduled meeting in our discord group and had a lengthy conversation about the block reward. Our block reward started at 5,000 RITO per block (every 60 seconds) just like Ravencoin. This extremely high number of coins coupled with the high profitability of mining led to unforeseen consequences with pools auto-exchanging the coin into bitcoin. This dumping by non-community miners had a very negative impact on the community sentiment and morale, as we watched the exchange price plunge. We looked at other coins and realized that this fate has befell many other coins with high block rewards. Following much discussion, we decided to change the reward structure. Starting around March 19th the block rewards will start to slowly go down in a curve until it reaches 1,000. Then the reduction will be even more slowed down with block rewards exponentially dropping at periodic intervals. We have posted charts on our website that shows what the long-term effects of our reward reducing algorithms will be. As a miner, the next 2 months will be a great time to mine and hold, while the block reward is still fairly high. We encourage all miners and cryptocurrency enthusiasts to take advantage of the current favourable block reward and build a nice holding for yourself. Then join the community and be a part of the fun we’re having with this project. This post was prepared by a collaboration of multiple Ritocoin members and was posted to reddit by the core developer Trevali, who posts to reddit under the ritocoin username and will be very happy to answer any questions anybody may have about our project. Traysi (well known in the Ravencoin community) is also an active Ritocoin developer and may come to this thread if needed. We welcome any questions from any of you regarding our project!
Continued censorship involving Ethereum's proposed fork to progPOW.
Our friends at Ethereum are subject to continued manipulation into forking their coin to progPOW. I decided to post this in /btc because it is the last bastion of free speech in the crypto community. Today, after drawing attention to the sketchy history of progPOW's original proponent, my post was subjected to massive vote manipulation, and eventually deleted. I have long suspected that progPOW favors NVIDIA miners, given the deep connections that progPOW's development team has to NVIDIA. Today, the progPOW team freely admitted that AMD miners will suffer a larger hashrate decrease compared to NVIDIA miners, so I created a poll: Ethereum developers want to fork to ETH to progPOW , a proof-of-work algorithm that gives AMD GPUs a stronger hashrate penalty compared to NVIDIA . Should Ethereum use ProgPOW for Proof-of-Work? Cast your vote with Ethereum . Sources:
Criticism and Soft Power I have received criticism for my posts mostly due to what people call "character attacks." I have two things to say about that:
I have never engaged in any character attacks. In all cases, the character has made their modus operandi known by themselves, and I have simply shined a light on it. I don't need call people "mentally unstable gentlemen" [--source, Ohgodagirl Twitter] to get my point across.
Algorithm change discussions must include economic and political introspection as well as a discussion of the proposed change's technical details. As I have stated before, progPOW would not exist without the people responsible for creating it. We must look at these people's history, character, prior accomplishments, and industry connections. The discussion must exist outside the scope of the proposed change, not inside of it.
Example: When people criticize my posts for "not looking at the technical details", they are making a mistake. If someone asked "which should we kill more often: baby seals or baby kittens?", we don't all immediately start discussing the optimal relation of kittens-per-second to seals-per-second that can be killed. No, our first reaction is "what the fuck, why should we kill anything?" Onward Customer complaints from people who bought cloud contracts from Kristy's previous company:
Coingeek Connection Previously, I had promised to provide information regarding the CSW/Coingeek and Core Scientific connection. When I was president of ImageShack.com (2003-2011), someone wanted to buy our company. When this happens, the buyer and seller usually write a purchase agreement similar to the business in which they are involved. This is done to ensure that the purchase is executed. In ImageShack's case, the buyer bought $500,000 worth of advertising from us. The logic was that ImageShack would be acquired, so they actually would pay themselves. If they didn't buy ImageShack, they would owe us $500,000. Given the partnership between Core Scientific (Kristy's employer) and "Squire Mining" (effectively, Coingeek), I would not be surprised if Coingeek and Core Scientific made such an agreement, as well. In their case, it would likely be a hosting agreement. Since Coingeek has many ASICs, and Core Scientific is a large mining facility, I would not be surprised if those Coingeek ASICs are hosted by Core Scientific. Individuals close to these parties can verify those claims, but I cannot share the proof at this time without revealing the identity of my sources. Chatlog Dumps Today, I also provide public comments from chatlog dumps showcasing Kristy Leigh Anne Minehan's deep connection to NVIDIA:
01/28/2018 - 22:34<@OhGodAGirl> Yo. ystarnaud/sling00: **I'll be meeting NV next week**. I think it's next week. The 4th! Anyway; if you have NVIDIA fixes you need for EthOS or something you want special attention on, PM me. 02/05/2018 - 06:47<@OhGodAGirl> Also I got a USB shaped like a NVIDIA GTX. It's the best thing ever. 02/05/2018 - 06:50<@OhGodAGirl> https://usercontent.irccloud-cdn.com/file/ffwT8M2j/IMG_2726.JPG 02/05/2018 - 06:50<@OhGodAGirl> Look at this adorable little shit.
"Ah, but there's a catch. These USB drives are extremely rare—Nvidia only cranked out a couple thousand of these drives and will be giving them away to press and "influencers" at E3, along with 1,080 registered GeForce Experience members who are opted in to receive communications from Nvidia."
04/22/2018 - 20:17<@sling00> OhGodAGirl: what does ohgodanethlargement do 04/22/2018 - 20:17< cYnIxX3> https://youtu.be/2mj1nCfFvlI?t=2m16s 04/22/2018 - 20:19< cYnIxX3> sling00, about 10-25mh improvement to 1080 gpus. 04/22/2018 - 20:19< __virus__> about 40-50% improvement afaik 04/22/2018 - 20:21< OhGodAGirl> But...it's not under because NVIDIA asked me not to. 04/21/2018 - 16:51< OhGodAGirl> I have a ton of private tools for Mineority 04/21/2018 - 16:51< OhGodAGirl> Right now our Equihash kernel has a 25% advantage over Claymore. 04/21/2018 - 16:52< PL3> 25% on amds? 04/21/2018 - 16:52< OhGodAGirl> NVIDIA ;) 04/21/2018 - 16:52< PL3> you have claymore nvidia equi miner? 04/21/2018 - 16:52< OhGodAGirl> We're a NV only company. For now. 04/29/2018 - 00:53< OhGodAGirl> So uh, NVIDIA showed ETHlargement at an executive meeting 04/29/2018 - 00:53< OhGodAGirl> They thought it was hillarious 04/29/2018 - 00:53< acv_> that is awesome. 04/29/2018 - 01:22< OhGodAGirl> So many dicks on Youtube though 04/29/2018 - 01:22< OhGodAGirl> "RA RA IT'S A SCAM" 04/29/2018 - 01:22< OhGodAGirl> "RA RA IT WILL STEAL ALL YOUR PRIVKEYS" 04/29/2018 - 01:22< OhGodAGirl> "RA RA NO ONE IS EVER NICE IN THIS WORLD' 04/29/2018 - 01:22< OhGodAGirl> Well dammit I'm a nice person. =(
Transcript of Open Developer Meeting in Discord - 7/19/2019
[Dev-Happy] BlondfrogsLast Friday at 3:58 PM Hey everyone. The channel is now open for the dev meeting. LSJI07 - MBITLast Friday at 3:58 PM Hi TronLast Friday at 3:59 PM Hi all! JerozLast Friday at 3:59 PM :wave: TronLast Friday at 3:59 PM Topics: Algo stuff - x22rc, Ownership token for Restricted Assets and Assets. JerozLast Friday at 4:00 PM @Milo is also here from coinrequest. MiloLast Friday at 4:00 PM Hi :thumbsup: Pho3nix Monk3yLast Friday at 4:00 PM welcome, @Milo TronLast Friday at 4:00 PM Great. @Milo Was there PRs for Android and iOS? MiloLast Friday at 4:01 PM Yes, I've made a video. Give me a second I'll share it asap. JerozLast Friday at 4:02 PM I missed the iOS one. MiloLast Friday at 4:02 PM Well its 1 video, but meant for all. JerozLast Friday at 4:02 PM Ah, there's an issue but no pull request (yet?) https://github.com/RavenProject/ravenwallet-ios/issues/115 [Dev-Happy] BlondfrogsLast Friday at 4:03 PM nice @Milo MiloLast Friday at 4:04 PM Can it be that I have no video post rights? JerozLast Friday at 4:05 PM In discord? MiloLast Friday at 4:05 PM yes? [Dev-Happy] BlondfrogsLast Friday at 4:05 PM just a link? JerozLast Friday at 4:05 PM Standard version has a file limit afaik Pho3nix Monk3yLast Friday at 4:05 PM try now gave permissions MiloLast Friday at 4:05 PM it's not published yet on Youtube, since I didn't knew when it would be published in the wallets file too big. Hold on i'll put it on youtube and set it on private LSJI07 - MBITLast Friday at 4:06 PM no worries ipfs it...:yum: Pho3nix Monk3yLast Friday at 4:06 PM ok, just send link when you can [Dev-Happy] BlondfrogsLast Friday at 4:07 PM So guys. We released Ravencoin v2.4.0! JerozLast Friday at 4:08 PM If you like the code. Go update them nodes! :smiley: [Dev-Happy] BlondfrogsLast Friday at 4:08 PM We are recommending that you are upgrading to it. It fixes a couple bugs in the code base inherited from bitcoin! MiloLast Friday at 4:08 PM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t\_g7NpFXm6g&feature=youtu.be sorry for the hold up YouTube Coin Request Raven dev Gemiddeld LSJI07 - MBITLast Friday at 4:09 PM thanks short and sweet!! KAwARLast Friday at 4:10 PM Is coin request live on the android wallet? TronLast Friday at 4:10 PM Nice video. It isn't in the Play Store yet. Pho3nix Monk3yLast Friday at 4:10 PM Well, this is the first time in a while where we have this many devs online. What questions do y'all have? LSJI07 - MBITLast Friday at 4:11 PM Algo questions? Pho3nix Monk3yLast Friday at 4:11 PM sure KAwARLast Friday at 4:11 PM KK LSJI07 - MBITLast Friday at 4:12 PM what are the proposed 22 algos in x22r? i could only find the original 16 plus 5 on x21. TronLast Friday at 4:12 PM Likely the 5 from x21 and find one more. We need to make sure they're all similar in time profile. liqdmetalLast Friday at 4:14 PM should we bother fixing a asic-problem that we dont know exists for sure or not? TronLast Friday at 4:14 PM That's the 170 million dollar question. [Dev-Happy] BlondfrogsLast Friday at 4:14 PM I would prefer to be proactive not reactive. imo JerozLast Friday at 4:14 PM same LSJI07 - MBITLast Friday at 4:15 PM RIPEMD160 is a golden oldie but not sure on hash speed compared to the others. liqdmetalLast Friday at 4:15 PM in my mind we should focus on the restricted messaging etc Sevvy (y rvn pmp?)Last Friday at 4:15 PM probably won't know if the action was needed until after you take the action liqdmetalLast Friday at 4:15 PM we are at risk of being interventionistas acting under opacity TronLast Friday at 4:15 PM Needs to spit out at least 256 bit. Preferably 512 bit. LSJI07 - MBITLast Friday at 4:15 PM ok TronLast Friday at 4:15 PM If it isn't 512 bit, it'll cause some extra headache for the GPU mining software. liqdmetalLast Friday at 4:16 PM i seek to avoid iatrogenics TronLast Friday at 4:16 PM Similar to the early problems when all the algos except the first one were built for 64-bytes (512-bit) inputs. Had to look that one up. TIL iatrogenics JerozLast Friday at 4:17 PM I have to google most of @liqdmetal's vocabulary :smile: liqdmetalLast Friday at 4:17 PM @Tron tldr: basically the unseen, unintended negative side effects of the asic "cure" Sevvy (y rvn pmp?)Last Friday at 4:18 PM 10 dolla word liqdmetalLast Friday at 4:19 PM we need a really strong case to intervene in what has been created. TronLast Friday at 4:19 PM I agree. I'm less concerned with the technical risk than I am the potential split risk experienced multiple times by Monero. Sevvy (y rvn pmp?)Last Friday at 4:20 PM tron do you agree that forking the ravencoin chain presents unique risks compared to other chains that aren't hosting assets? JerozLast Friday at 4:21 PM Yes, if you fork, you need to figure out for each asset which one you want to support. Sevvy (y rvn pmp?)Last Friday at 4:21 PM yeah. and the asset issuer could have a chain preference TronLast Friday at 4:22 PM @Sevvy (y rvn pmp?) Sure. Although, I'd expect that the asset issuers will be honor the assets on the dominant chain. Bigger concern is the branding confusion of multiple forks. See Bitcoin, Bitcoin Cash, Bitcoin SV for an example. We know they're different, but do non-crypto folks? Hans_SchmidtLast Friday at 4:22 PM I thought that the take-away from the recently published analyses and discussions was that ASICs for RVN may be active, but if so then they are being not much more effective than GPUs. Sevvy (y rvn pmp?)Last Friday at 4:22 PM agreed on all accounts there tron TronLast Friday at 4:23 PM I'm not yet convinced ASICs are on the network. KAwARLast Friday at 4:23 PM It would be better to damage an asic builder by forking after they made major expenses. Creating for them the type of deficit that could be negated by just buying instead of mining. Asic existence should be 100 percent confirmed before fork. liqdmetalLast Friday at 4:23 PM 170million dollar question is right.lol TronLast Friday at 4:24 PM I've had someone offer to connect me to the folks at Fusion Silicon. Sevvy (y rvn pmp?)Last Friday at 4:25 PM yes. and if they are active on the network they are not particularly good ASICs which makes it a moot point probably TronLast Friday at 4:26 PM The difficult part of this problem is that by the time everyone agrees that ASICs are problematic on the network, then voting the option in is likely no longer an option. Sevvy (y rvn pmp?)Last Friday at 4:26 PM yes. part of me wonders if we would say "okay, the clock on the asic countdown is reset by this new algo. but now the race is on" [Dev-Happy] BlondfrogsLast Friday at 4:26 PM There are always risks when making a change that will fork the network. We want wait to long though, as tron said. It wont be a voting change. it will be a mandatory change at a block number. Sevvy (y rvn pmp?)Last Friday at 4:26 PM acknowledge the inevitable MiloLast Friday at 4:27 PM I had just a small question from my side. When do you think the android version would be published, and do you maybe have a time-frame for the others? TronLast Friday at 4:27 PM Quick poll. How would everyone here feel about a BIP9 option - separate from the new features that can be voted in? KAwARLast Friday at 4:27 PM Maybe voting should not be a strictly blockchain vote. A republic and a democratic voice? [Dev-Happy] BlondfrogsLast Friday at 4:27 PM @Milo We can try and get a beta out next week, and publish soon after that. MiloLast Friday at 4:28 PM @[Dev-Happy] Blondfrogs :thumbsup::slight_smile: [Dev-Happy] BlondfrogsLast Friday at 4:28 PM BIP9 preemptive vote. I like it. TronLast Friday at 4:30 PM The advantage to a BIP9 vote is that it puts the miners and mining pools at a clear majority before activation. LSJI07 - MBITLast Friday at 4:30 PM Centralisation is inevitable unless we decide to resist it. ASIC's are market based and know the risks and rewards possible. A key step in resisting is sending a message. An algo change to increase asic resistance is imho a strong message. A BIP9 vote now would also be an indicator of bad actors early.... TronLast Friday at 4:30 PM The disadvantage is that it may not pass if the will isn't there. LSJI07 - MBITLast Friday at 4:30 PM Before assets are on main net and cause additional issues. KAwARLast Friday at 4:31 PM I am not schooled in coding to have an educated voice. I only understand social problems and how it affects the economy. SpyderDevLast Friday at 4:31 PM All are equal on RVN TronLast Friday at 4:31 PM It is primarily a social problem. The tech change is less risky and is easier than the social. LSJI07 - MBITLast Friday at 4:32 PM All can have a share....people who want more of a share however pay for the privilege and associated risks. KAwARLast Friday at 4:33 PM Assets and exchange listings need to be consistent and secure. brutoidLast Friday at 4:36 PM I'm still not entirely clear on what the overall goal to the algo change is? Is it just to brick the supposed ASICs (unknown 45%) which could still be FPGAs as seen from the recent block analysis posted in the nest. Is the goal to never let ASICs on? Is it to brick FPGAs ultimately. Are we making Raven strictly GPU only? I'm still unclear LSJI07 - MBITLast Friday at 4:37 PM What about the future issue of ASICs returning after a BIP9 fork "soon"? Are all following the WP as a community? i.e asic resistant or are we prepared to change that to asic resistant for early coin emission. Ideally we should plan for the future. Could the community make a statement that no future algo changes will be required to incentivise future public asic manufacturers? Lol. Same question @brutoid brutoidLast Friday at 4:37 PM Haha it is You mind-beamed me! [Dev-Happy] BlondfrogsLast Friday at 4:38 PM The is up to the community. Currently, the feel seems like the community is anti asic forever. The main issue is getting people to upgrade. KAwARLast Friday at 4:38 PM Clarity is important. Otherwise we are attacking windmills like Don Quixote. brutoidLast Friday at 4:39 PM I'm not getting the feeling of community ASIC hate if the last few weeks of discussion are anything to go by? Hans_SchmidtLast Friday at 4:39 PM A unilateral non-BIP9 change at a chosen block height is a serious thing, but anti-ASIC has been part of the RVN philosophy since the whitepaper and is therefore appropriate for that purpose. [Dev-Happy] BlondfrogsLast Friday at 4:39 PM We can use the latest release as an example. It was a non forking release, announced for 2 weeks. and only ~30% of the network has upgraded. TronLast Friday at 4:39 PM @Hans_Schmidt Well said. liqdmetalLast Friday at 4:40 PM I'm not concerned about a "asic hardware problem" so much as I believe it more likely what we are seeing is several big fish miners (perhaps a single really big fish). For now I recommend standing pat on x16r. In the future I can see an algo upgrade fork to keep the algo up to date. If we start fighting against dedicated x16r hashing machines designed and built to secure our network we are more likely to go down in flames. The custom SHA256 computers that make the bitcoin the most secure network in existence are a big part of that security. If some party has made an asic that performs up to par or better than FPGA or GPU on x16r, that is a positive for this network, a step towards SHA256 security levels. It is too bad the community is in the dark regarding their developments. Therefore I think the community has to clarify its stance towards algorithm changes. I prefer a policy that will encourage the development of mining software, bitstreams and hardware by as many parties as possible. The imminent threat of ALGO fork screws the incentive up for developers. JerozLast Friday at 4:40 PM @brutoid the vocal ones are lenient towards asics, but the outcome of the 600+ votes seemed pretty clear. brutoidLast Friday at 4:40 PM This is my confusion TronLast Friday at 4:41 PM More hashes are only better if the cost goes up proportionally. Machines that do more hashes for less $ doesn't secure the network more, and trends towards centralization. JerozLast Friday at 4:41 PM I would argue for polling ever so often as it certainly will evolve dynamically with the state of crypto over time. TronLast Friday at 4:41 PM Measure security in two dimensions. Distribution, and $/hash. liqdmetalLast Friday at 4:41 PM and volume of hash traysiLast Friday at 4:42 PM 45% of the hashrate going to one party is unhealthy, and standing pat on x16r just keeps that 45% where it is. TronLast Friday at 4:42 PM Volume doesn't matter if the cost goes down. For example, lets say software shows up that does 1000x better than the software from yesterday, and everyone moves to it. That does not add security. Even if the "difficulty" and embedded hashes took 1000x more attempts to find. brutoidLast Friday at 4:42 PM My issue is defintely centralization of hash and not so much what machine is doing it. I mine with both GPU and FPGA. Of course, the FPGAs are not on raven TJayLast Friday at 4:44 PM easy solution is just to replace a few of 16 current hash functions, without messing with x21r or whatever new shit TronLast Friday at 4:44 PM How do folks here feel about allowing CPUs back in the game? traysiLast Friday at 4:44 PM Botnets is my concern with CPUs brutoidLast Friday at 4:44 PM Botnets is my concern SpyderDevLast Friday at 4:44 PM Yes please. LSJI07 - MBITLast Friday at 4:44 PM the poll votes seem not very security conscious. More of day miners chasing profits. I love them bless! Imho the future is bright for raven, however these issues if not sorted out now will bite hard long term when asset are on the chain and gpu miners are long gone..... ZaabLast Friday at 4:45 PM How has the testing of restricted assets been on the test net? liqdmetalLast Friday at 4:45 PM Agreed. I dont think x16r is obsolete like that yet however [Dev-Happy] BlondfrogsLast Friday at 4:45 PM @Zaab not enough testing at the moment. HedgerLast Friday at 4:45 PM Yes, how is the Testing going? justinjjaLast Friday at 4:45 PM Like randomX or how are cpus going to be back in the game? TronLast Friday at 4:45 PM @Zaab Just getting started at testing at the surface level (RPC calls), and fixing as we go. ZaabLast Friday at 4:45 PM And or any updates on the review of dividend code created by the community Lokar -=Kai=-Last Friday at 4:45 PM if the amount of hash the unknown pool has is fixed as standarderror indicated then waiting for the community of FPGAers to get onto raven might be advantageous if the fork doesn't hurt FPGAs. ZaabLast Friday at 4:45 PM Can't rememeber who was on it SpyderDevLast Friday at 4:45 PM @Zaab But we are working on it... Lokar -=Kai=-Last Friday at 4:46 PM more hash for votes JerozLast Friday at 4:46 PM @Maldon is, @Zaab TronLast Friday at 4:46 PM @Zaab There are unit tests and functional tests already, but we'd like more. [Dev-Happy] BlondfrogsLast Friday at 4:46 PM @Zaab Dividend code is currently adding test cases for better security. Should have more update on that next meeting KAwARLast Friday at 4:46 PM Absolute democracy seems to resemble anarchy or at least civil war. In EVE online they have a type of community voice that get voted in by the community. ZaabLast Friday at 4:46 PM No worries was just curious if it was going as planned or significant issues were being found Obviously some hiccups are expected More testing is always better! TronLast Friday at 4:47 PM Who in here is up for a good civil war? :wink: ZaabLast Friday at 4:47 PM Tron v Bruce. Celebrity fight night with proceeds to go to the RVN dev fund SpyderDevLast Friday at 4:48 PM Cagefight or mudpit? JerozLast Friday at 4:48 PM talking about dev funds..... :wink: Pho3nix Monk3yLast Friday at 4:49 PM and there goes the conversation.... KAwARLast Friday at 4:49 PM I am trying to be serious... ZaabLast Friday at 4:49 PM Sorry back to the ascii topic! traysiLast Friday at 4:49 PM @Tron What do we need in order to make progress toward a decision on the algo? Is there a plan or a roadmap of sorts to get us some certainty about what we're going to do? LSJI07 - MBITLast Friday at 4:50 PM Could we have 3 no BIP9 votes? No1 Friendly to asics, retain status quo. No2 change to x17r minimal changes etc, with no additional future PoW/algo upgrades. No3. Full Asic resistance x22r and see what happens... :thonk~1: Sounds messy.... TronLast Friday at 4:51 PM Right now we're in research mode. We're building CNv4 so we can run some metrics. If that goes well, we can put together x22rc and see how it performs. It will likely gore everyone's ox. CPUs can play, GPUs work, but aren't dominant. ASICs VERY difficult, and FPGAs will have a tough time. ZaabLast Friday at 4:51 PM Yeah i feel like the results would be unreliable TronLast Friday at 4:51 PM Is this good, or do we lose everyone's vote? PlayHardLast Friday at 4:52 PM Fpga will be dead Lokar -=Kai=-Last Friday at 4:52 PM why isn;t a simple XOR or something on the table? ZaabLast Friday at 4:52 PM The multiple bip9 that is Lokar -=Kai=-Last Friday at 4:52 PM something asic breaking but doesn't greatly complicate ongoing efforts for FPGA being my point. justinjjaLast Friday at 4:52 PM How are you going to vote for x22rc? Because if by hashrate that wouldn't pass. traysiLast Friday at 4:52 PM Personally I like the idea of x22rc but I'd want to investigate the botnet threat if CPUs are allowed back in. TronLast Friday at 4:52 PM XOR is on the table, and was listed in my Medium post. But, the social risk of chain split remains, for very little gain. traysiLast Friday at 4:53 PM @Lokar -=Kai=- A small change means that whoever has 45% can probably quickly adapt. LSJI07 - MBITLast Friday at 4:53 PM Research sounds good. x22rc could be reduce to x22r for simplicity... TronLast Friday at 4:53 PM x22r is a viable option. No CNv4. LSJI07 - MBITLast Friday at 4:53 PM Don't know how much time we have to play with though... Lokar -=Kai=-Last Friday at 4:53 PM if they have FPGAs yes if they have ASIC then not so much, but I guess that gets to the point, what exactly are we trying to remove from the network? PlayHardLast Friday at 4:54 PM Guys my name is Arsen and we designed x16r fpga on bcus. Just about to release it to the public. I am buzzdaves partner. Cryptonight Will kill us But agreed Asic is possible on x16r And you dont need 256 core Cores traysiLast Friday at 4:55 PM Hi Arsen. Are you saying CN will kill "us" meaning RVN, or meaning FPGA? JerozLast Friday at 4:55 PM This is what im afraid of ^ an algo change killing FPGA as I have the feeling there is a big fpga community working on this PlayHardLast Friday at 4:55 PM Fpgas )) whitefire990Last Friday at 4:55 PM I am also about to release X16R for CVP13 + BCU1525 FPGA's. I'm open to algo changes but I really don't believe in CPU mining because of botnets. Any CNv4 shifts 100% to CPU mining, even if it is only 1 of the 22 functions. Lokar -=Kai=-Last Friday at 4:55 PM namely FPGAs that aren;t memory equipped like fast mem not ddr PlayHardLast Friday at 4:55 PM Hbm non hbm Cryptonight whitefire990Last Friday at 4:56 PM Right now with both Buzzdave/Altered Silicon and myself (Zetheron) about to release X16R for FPGA's, then the 45% miner's share will decrease to 39% or less. PlayHardLast Friday at 4:56 PM Will be dead for fpga LSJI07 - MBITLast Friday at 4:56 PM sound so x22r is fpga "friendly" ... more so than asic anyway... PlayHardLast Friday at 4:56 PM But a change must be planned X16r is no way possible to avoid asics TJayLast Friday at 4:56 PM @LSJI07 - MBIT I would say less friendly... whitefire990Last Friday at 4:57 PM As I mentioned in thenest discussion, asic resistance increases with the square of the number of functions, so X21R is more asic resistant than X16R, but both are pretty resistant PlayHardLast Friday at 4:58 PM Yeah more algos make it heavier on ASIC DirkDiggler (Citadel Architect)Last Friday at 4:58 PM My interpretation of the whitepaper was that we used x16r as it was brand new (thus ASIC resistant), and that was to ensure a fair launch... We've launched... I don't like the idea of constantly forking to avoid the inevitable ASICs. x16r was a great "experiment" before we had any exchange listings... that ship has sailed though... not sure about all these x22rs lmnop changes KAwARLast Friday at 5:00 PM I believe that it is easier to change the direction of a bicycle than an oil tanker. We feel more like a train. We should lay out new tracks and test on them and find benefits that are acceptable to everyone except train robbers. Then open the new train station with no contentious feelings except a silently disgruntled minority group. ??? Hans_SchmidtLast Friday at 5:01 PM The most productive action the community can do now re ASICs is to voice support for the devs to make a non-BIP9 change at a chosen block height if/when the need is clear. That removes the pressure to act rashly to avoid voting problems. LSJI07 - MBITLast Friday at 5:01 PM Thats why im proposing to fork at least once to a more asic resistant algo (but FPGA "friendly/possible"), with the proviso ideally that no more PoW algo forks are require to provide future ASICs some opportunity to innovate with silicon and efficiency. TJayLast Friday at 5:01 PM folks should take into account, that high end FPGAs like BCU1525 on x16r can't beat even previous gen GPUs (Pascal) in terms of hash cost. so they aren't a threat to miners community PlayHardLast Friday at 5:02 PM A proper change Requires proper research eyz (Silence)Last Friday at 5:02 PM Just so I'm clear here, we are trying to boot ASICS, don't want CPUs because of Botnets, and are GPU and FPGA friendly right? PlayHardLast Friday at 5:02 PM It is not a quick one day process eyz (Silence)Last Friday at 5:02 PM If there is a bip9 vote there needs to be a clear explanation as I feel most in the community don't understand exactly what we are trying to fix TronLast Friday at 5:03 PM @Hans_Schmidt I like that route. It has some game theoretics. It gives time for miners to adapt. It is only used if needed. It reduces the likelihood of ASICs dominating the network, or even being built. [Dev-Happy] BlondfrogsLast Friday at 5:03 PM Hey guys. great convo. We are of course looking to do the best thing for the community and miner. We are going to be signing off here though. justinjjaLast Friday at 5:03 PM TJay that comes down to power cost. If your paying 4c/kw gpus all the way. But if your a home miner in europe an fpga is your only chance LSJI07 - MBITLast Friday at 5:03 PM @Hans_Schmidt How do we decide the block limit and when sufficient evidence is available? I would say we have had much compelling information to date... [Dev-Happy] BlondfrogsLast Friday at 5:03 PM Thanks for participating. and keep up the good work :smiley: Have a good weekend. CAWWWW TronLast Friday at 5:03 PM I haven't seen any compelling evidence of ASICs - yet. Pho3nix Monk3yLast Friday at 5:03 PM :v: JerozLast Friday at 5:04 PM I suggest to continue discussion in #development and #thenest :smiley: thanks all! TronLast Friday at 5:04 PM Cheers everyone! KAwARLast Friday at 5:04 PM Agree with Hans. DirkDiggler (Citadel Architect)Last Friday at 5:04 PM thanks Tron Pho3nix Monk3yLast Friday at 5:04 PM Ending here. continue in Nest if wanted DirkDiggler (Citadel Architect)Last Friday at 5:04 PM I am waiting for compelling evidence myself.
Profitable Crypto Mining: ASIC vs GPU, Which One Is Better?
If you’re new to mining you probably have multiple questions running through your head right now. Good news is that it gets easier with time, assuming that you do your homework and research, and we will try to help you out. One of the common questions is whether one should choose GPU or ASIC mining and we definitely have some advice on that topic. When we’re considering classic POW mining we can quickly rule out CPU hardware for not being efficient and FPGA hardware because of its high costs. This leaves you with ASIC and GPU to choose from. https://preview.redd.it/igev3y4v8pv31.png?width=1920&format=png&auto=webp&s=2a0c9271fc36252181d086e74101d13875619c80
Buying Mining Equipment
Let’s get things straight — you won’t be able to buy ASIC devices in any of you local electronic shops, even in the biggest ones. There are two ways you can get this hardware: buying it online which shouldn’t be a problem these days unless that’s the newest model you’re after. Second option is to find a local company that sells ASIC equipment. Also, you can try to purchase the equipment directly from the manufacture company, however, mind the huge customs and delivery fees if the company is located abroad. It is highly recommended to test ASICs before buying them to make sure the equipment works properly. GPU or graphics cards and other equipment that you will need to build your very own mining farm can be easily purchased at a regular computer store. The only problem you may have is getting the right set of hardware, so make sure to come prepared. When buying a used (second-hand) graphics card don’t forget to test it. What’s better? If you’re not into hardware and have no clue how to set up a farm by yourself buying ASIC equipment would be a better option as you won’t need to build anything yourself.
In general, an official warranty policy for ASIC hardware is up to 180 days since the equipment was shipped to the buyer. When the seller is confident about the quality of their equipment, they can offer their personal 1 month warranty. When you’re buying computer hardware in most of the cases you are getting full 2 year warranty policy including exchange or repairments of the equipment. What’s better? Warranty policy is especially important when you have no chance to check the equipment yourself or when you’re buying large inventory of it. Also, if you plan to go with overclocking, you will probably need a decent warranty as well. We need to add that when you’re using the equipment accordingly and conduct regular maintenance both ASIC and GPU can work past the warranty period.
Setting Up Process
With ASICs it’s simple: you plug and connect it, pick a pool to join and start mining right away. With GPU, it’s a little complicated. First, you need to build your farm. You will need a framework, motherboard with installed CPU and cooling, storage unit, power supply, risers and video cards. If you have no experience with assembling computer hardware you’re gonna need to save some time and prepare to put extra effort. Once your rig is ready you will have to install OS and optimize it which is usually even harder than setting up a rig. But luckily we’ve got a solution for that. CoinFly can do the work for you and help you with setting up and optimizing your equipment. What’s better? Although ASICs are very easy, you shouldn’t quickly give up on GPU mining. If assembling computer hardware is not a big problem for you, CoinFly will help you with setting it up.
ASIC equipment won’t give you too much trouble: it’s safe, stable, and doesn’t require any special knowledge. Maintenance includes cleaning off dust and oiling the fans. When dealing with rigs, you will have to work a little harder and study the basics about at least graphics cards’ temperatures and operational frequency. A stable workflow depends heavily on the software and as it has a tendency to fail, it could become a problem. Unless you’re using CoinFly — our system will notify you in case of emergency so you can tune your equipment online. What’s better? Once again, when it comes to maintaining ASICs are almost trouble-free. GPU rigs are a bit tricky but when using the right tools like CoinFly to monitor their work, it can serve you just fine.
ASICs are loud: when you’re in a room with a working ASIC you’re gonna need to shout, so people can hear you. GPU farms have no such problem. Some of them are almost silent and that doesn’t affect the cooling process at all. What’s better? Maybe the level of noise your equipment makes was not the first issue on your list but we recommend you to consider it. ASICs are suitable only for the commercial and industrial premises.
ASICs can work with only one algorithm and mine one or several types of cryptocurrencies and are perfect for mining Bitcoin and its forks. GPU rigs are universal: you can mine a huge variety of coins if you set your miner right. What’s better? If you want to mine Bitcoin, you gotta go with ASIC. But think again if that’s what you’re really after. After all, you can choose mining any altcoin that you’d like with your GPU rig and then simply exchange it to BTC. And if you’re lucky enough to mine a coin that will do good ASICs do not give you that choice, however, their mining capability is higher.
Relevance of the Equipment
ASICs are quickly getting out of date as the new models come along. Back in the day, the new versions used to come out every half a year and they were 10 times more efficient. In general, you need to change your ASIC hardware every year. GPU equipment can perfectly serve you for 2 to 3 years and if you wish to sell the graphics card afterwards that wouldn’t be a problem either. What’s better? In terms of relevance, it’s probably reasonable to go with the GPU.
Return on Investment
In the long run, the profitableness of ASICs is higher but because the new models are being released quite frequently you cannot expect huge profits. It is always important to do your research and get the most relevant equipment. GPU hardware will take its time to pay you back but it also depends if you manage to find the right coin to mine that will eventually increase your profits. What’s better? ASIC mining is definitely a good option for those who don’t want to constantly monitor the crypto market. But in the case that you’re interested in what’s happening in the crypto space and you also have time to do your own research, the GPU farm would the better choice. If you’re not willing to spend your efforts on that, CoinFly Autopilot mode will help you mine the most profitable coin on the market automatically.
ASICs are great for people who can provide a non-residential space for mining and not willing to spend too much time and effort for setting up the equipment and stay updated with the latest trends in the crypto industry. GPU rigs are suitable for mining at home and won’t scare away all the crypto and computer enthusiasts. If you’re just starting your mining journey but not sure how to do it, we recommend to register on CoinFly. From setting up your hardware to tuning it online and picking the best coin to mine at the moment — we’ve got you covered!
Hello, I’ve been trying to decide on a FPGA development board, and have only been able to find posts and Reddit threads from 4-5 years ago. So I wanted to start a new thread and ask about the best “mid-range” FGPA development board in 2018. (Price range $100-$300.) I started with this Quora answer about FPGA boards, from 2013. The Altera DE1 sounded good. Then I looked through the Terasic DE boards. Then I found this Reddit thread from 2014, asking about the DE1-SoC vs the Cyclone V GX Starter Kit: https://www.reddit.com/FPGA/comments/1xsk6w/cyclone_v_gx_starter_kit_vs_de1soc_board/ (I was also leaning towards the DE1-SoC.) Anyway, I thought I better ask here, because there are probably some new things to be aware of in 2018. I’m completely new to FPGAs and VHDL, but I have experience with electronics/microcontrollers/programming. My goal is to start with some basic soft-core processors. I want to get some C / Rust programs compiling and running on my own CPU designs. I also want to play around with different instruction sets, and maybe start experimenting with asynchronous circuits (e.g. clock-less CPUs) Also I don’t know if this is possible, but I’d like to experiment with ternary computing, or work with analog signals instead of purely digital logic. EDIT: I just realized that you would call those FPAAs, i.e. “analog” instead of “gate”. Would be cool if there was a dev board that also had an FPAA, but no problem if not. EDIT 2: I also realized why "analog signals on an FPGA" doesn't make any sense, because of how LUTs work. They emulate boolean logic with a lookup table, and the table can only store 0s and 1s. So there's no way to emulate a transistor in an intermediate state. I'll just have play around with some transistors on a breadboard. UPDATE: I've put together a table with some of the best options:
A very simple FPGA development board that plugs into a Raspberry Pi, so you have a "backup" hard-core CPU that can control networking, etc. Supports a huge range of pmod accessories. You can write a program/circuit so that the Raspberry Pi CPU and the FPGA work together, similar to a SoC. Proprietary bitstream is fully reverse engineered and supported by Project IceStorm, and there is an open-source toolchain that can compile your hardware design to bitstream. Has everything you need to start experimenting with FPGAs.
Xilinx Zynq 7-Series SoC - ARM Cortex-A9 processor, and Artix-7 FPGA. 125 IO pins. 1GB DDR2 RAM. Texas Instruments WiLink 8 wireless module for 802.11n Wi-Fi and Bluetooth 4.1. No LEDs or buttons, but easy to wire up your own on a breadboard. If you want to use a baseboard, you'll need a snickerdoodle black ($195) with the pins in the "down" orientation. (E.g. The "breakyBreaky breakout board" ($49) or piSmasher SBC ($195)). The snickerdoodle one only comes with pins in the "up" orientation and doesn't support any baseboards. But you can still plug the jumpers into the pins and wire up things on a breadboard.
Has one of the latest Xilinx SoCs. 2 GB (512M x32) LPDDR4 Memory. Wi-Fi / Bluetooth. Mini DisplayPort. 1x USB 3.0 type Micro-B, 2x USB 3.0 Type A. Audio I/O. Four user-controllable LEDs. No buttons and limited LEDs, but easy to wire up your own on a breadboard
Xilinx Zynq 7000 SoC (ARM Cortex-A9, 7-series FPGA.) 1 GB DDR3 RAM. A few switches, push buttons, and LEDs. USB and Ethernet. Audio in/out ports. HDMI source + sink with CEC. 8 Total Processor I/O, 40 Total FPGA I/O. Also a faster version for $299 (Zybo Z7-20).
Same as DE10-Standard, but not as many peripherals, buttons, LEDs, etc.
icoBoard ($100). (Buy it here.) The icoBoard plugs into a Raspberry Pi, so it's similar to having a SoC. The iCE40-HX8K chip comes with 7,680 LUTs (logic elements.) This means that after you learn the basics and create some simple circuits, you'll also have enough logic elements to run the VexRiscv soft-core CPU (the lightweight Murax SoC.) The icoBoard also supports a huge range of pluggable pmod accessories:
numato Mimas A7 ($149). An excellent development board with a Xilinx Artix 7 FPGA, so you can play with a bigger / faster FPGA and run a full RISC-V soft-core with all the options enabled, and a much higher clock speed. (The iCE40 FPGAs are a bit slow and small.)
I ordered a iCE40-HX8K Breakout Board to try out the IceStorm open source tooling. (I would have ordered an icoBoard if I had found it earlier.) I also bought a numato Mimas A7 so that I could experiment with the Artix 7 FPGA and Xilinx software (Vivado Design Suite.)
What can I do with an FPGA? / How many LUTs do I need?
VexRiscv is "A FPGA friendly 32 bit RISC-V CPU implementation." This is a RISC-V implementation written in SpinalHDL. VexRiscv has a lot of plugin and configuration options. The Murax SoC is a very light SoC that can run on an iCE40-HX8k (but probably not the 1k FPGA that only has 1,280 LUTs). The Briey SoC only runs on Xilinx or Altera FPGAs.
Some rational thinking (and numbers) on ASICs/Dedicated Hardware
The current ETH price is bad - we can all clearly see that, having dropped to almost 25% of ATH. So over that period of time miners have lost 75% of their profits + the difficulty increases. The current difficulty HAS started slowing/plateauing. Just zoom in on that etherscan.io graph for Oct-Present and that is obvious. Current difficulty is 265 TH/s or so. That’s about 10 MILLION GPUs @ 26 MH average. The looming fear has been this idea that Dedicated hardware (regardless of ASIC/FPGA/Custom GPUs) are going to completely destroy mining in the near term. I’m here to loudly say that’s a bunch of FUD. Here is my reasoning.
The rumors peg F3 hashrates between 250 and 600 MH for $3000-$6000. $3000-7500 would get you about the same range with commodity GPUs (if you bargain shop and are efficient building rigs). Initial cost is maybe a 10-20% advantage. Those buying used cards get that deal now.
Power usage rumored are 750w or so. Commodity rig with the same GPU power 1200-2400W. So maybe 3x power advantage / operating cost. At $0.10/kW that amounts to $120/mo of savings in the best case, and the 600 MH is currently worth $520 or so at these depressed prices. So you make 23% more.
Next gen GPUs using GDDR6 will almost certainly double hashrates. Without going into the details, it is sufficient to say GDDR6 will double memory bandwidth for all classes of GPUs using it and thus will almost certainly double hashrate for the same power. A major memory change like this hasn’t happened in more than 5 years. Mining has basically never seen it. This should narrow or eliminate any dedicated hardware gap, even if it doesn’t help current card investments... but those are still pretty safe, see #4.
ASIC/Dedicated production is super unlikely to make any significant dent in difficulty for a while. Let’s say the batch size is an extremely aggressive 5,000 units a week, each producing the output of 20 typical GPUs. That’s the same as 100,000 GPUs being introduced a week - but that would only be a 1.1% difficulty increase per week. It would take two years of ASICs for difficulty to double and your $520/mo to drop to $260 - assuming ETH price remained constant. Meanwhile over 4 million GPUs came online between December and January - Thats 10x more new GPU miners per week than Bitmain production could have supported brining online.
You aren’t competing against ASICs. You’re competing against price, which is partially dropping due to all this FUD and uncertainty about ASICs, and you are competing with the millions of get rich quick miners that started, with their GPUs, this spring. For reference bitcoin ASICs, and other not-ASIC resistant algorithms compete with ASIC systems that are 1-100 orders of magnitude faster for cost/power than the GPU miners. That is NOT the case here, we’re looking at 20-30% savings and only till the next gen of GPUs, and this is why ETH has met its project goal of being ASIC resistant - which does not mean it is impossible to build dedicated hardware to mine ETH, it simply means that such hardware won’t change the landscape. Bitcoin was also much smaller than ETH in terms of number of GPUs mining when ASICs were introduced, which is why a relatively low volume of ASIC production that were orders of magnitude better than GPUs resulted in such a disruption to Bitcoin mining. The same holds true of the much smaller coins that were being dual mined. In summary - you are losing profits because of FUD and market shifts lowering price, and that will continue to be why you’re losing money - not ASICs or dedicated hardware. The sooner the community stops running around like chickens with their heads cut off and realigns with focusing on the goals for Ethereum itself, the sooner the situation and price will stabilize. Besides, POS is always coming eventually...
Flashback Friday: When I though I was going to be rich :-)
I was going through my crypto archive and here a picture when time were not just better but unbelievably profitable for a hobby miner (and made me spend a bit too much money on hardware). This was on 24 January 2018, and I was pulling 0,0026 BTC per day (back then it was 23ish EUR with the EUBTC rate) on 10 low-middle grade GPUs. This was without any kind of OC (I was going full blast, it was just so profitable, lol). 2 * rx570 + 8 Nvidia (3 * 1050ti + 5 1060 6Go). Now I have 2 more GPUs, finely tuned OC, and I would get around 0,5mBTC/Day (below electricity cost in my region). https://i.redd.it/ikgdsawsysk11.jpg I guess when something is too good to be true, it's too good to be true. But I was drawn into it. I was always curious about Bitcoin when BTC was 200 euro but back then it wasn't profitable anyway already because of FPGA and ASIC and I wasn't really clear where to buy BTC that wouldn't scam me of my money. BTC went to 600 euro and I though things have peaked already so I was fuck it I'm too late for the party. I admit FOMO brought me in with the Bullrun end 2017. Now, we are in september, back in DecembeJanuary I projected that I should BE my initial investment in July and start printing money by then. Right now, I'm something like <30% BE it and the value of my stack is still going down since I've HODL all of my BTC and never sold. Nowadays, my rig is off because electricity is too expensive to make it run (Western Europe problem I know) so I can't even continue to progress to my BE even when electricity is cheaper at night. Tried mining ETH directly but the difficulty is ridiculous, the value took a nose dive, payout are unpredictably because of pool luck and pplns scheme, tried mining RVN but came late to the party pool luck and payement are even worse on RVN than on ETH. - I would make more RVN mining ETH and buying RVN with ETH. - I would also make more ETH mining on Nicehash and purchasing ETH with BTC. But then, I would be trading so what's the point of mining. I think I'll go deeper the rabbit hole and start mining speculative low diff coins if I can find a good project, but every project I hear from seems to already being past that point so I can't build a bag :-( I'm happy I haven't got overboard with the spending and I'm glad I've learn many thing in this space along the way. So glad I didn't pull the trigger on a couple of Titan XP, I seriously considered it back when it was still profitable. But being in profit seems to be a concept that I'll probably never reach. So I'll guess "I'm in it for the tech" like so many people can say. I guess this post will have the merit to warn potential adventurers to reconsider spending any amount of money they are not ready to be parted from. If however you have "free electricity" I still wish you good luck because at a large scale you still won't BE the initial investment if you want to build today, and at a small scale, you won't make a buck anyway and just provide cheap hashrate to NH buyers.
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